Liddle Dies in 1911--Getting A Date

Date: Sunday, September 3, 1911  

Paper: Philadelphia Inquirer (Philadelphia, PA)  --obtained 

on Genealogybank

It has been a while since we have mentioned the Liddles. This death notice for William B. Liddle was located in a Philadelphia newspaper from 1911. I was hoping to obtain more information on William than this death notice provides, but at least I have an approximate date of death--August of 1911. That will allow me to search unindexed records that are organized by date. I'm trying to locate places of birth for William B. Liddle and his father.

Charles B. Liddle was the father of Charles A. Liddle, a railroad company executive in Chicago in the early 20th century. In a roundabout way, I'm hoping that there is a connection between this Liddle family and the actual family I'm working on.

Geo Can Jno F Liddle is Quite a Name

One has to love this name "Geo Can Jno F Liddle."

This person is supposedly buried in the Laurel Hill Cemetery in Philadelphia according to Ancestry.com's Pennsylvania, Church and Town Records, 1708-1985 database.

A look at the actual entry indicates that actually two people are referenced in the entry that generated the index items shown above.

The reference is actually to George C. and John F. Liddle. The entry appears to have been written as "Geo. C and John F." 

The year is 1866--at least according to this entry. More work needs to be done on this Liddle family. 

This may or may not be the George C. on whom I'm working. He died in 1848 and is buried in the Philanthropic Cemetery. But as we'll see in a later post that might not be quite exactly where he is located either. 

An 1848 List of Burials Includes George Liddell

A few images before the 1848 City of Philadelphia death "certificate" for George C. Liddell is a "cover sheet" or sorts for several burials that took place in the Philanthropic Burial Ground in Philadelphia for the week ending 30 September 1848. We've already blogged about his death certificate before. The image that follows is the "cover sheet."

It appears that these certificates were all "recorded" or returned at the same time.

One issue with this material is how it should be cited. There are no page numbers for either this page or the death "certificate" for George C. Liddell. Yet the question of how to get later searchers to these specific records if they need to see them remains. The issue of citation cannot be ignored simply because I already have the images. The easiest way to cite should probably involve the name of the group of records, City of Philadelphia death certificates and the year and name of the entry. A reference to this "cover sheet" is necessary as well as it may impact the perceived reliability of these records.

The fact that these burials were recorded together makes me wonder ever so slightly about potential errors in these records. In the case of George, as mentioned in earlier blog posts, his death record indicates he died in Kington, NY and his obituary indicates he died in NJ. I'm not certain that at this point one can simply say the death "record" is necessarily the most accurate. The "group" nature of these records has me slightly questioning whether the NY reference could be incorrect.

The actual image of the "cover sheet" can be seen here.

On my "to do" list is to look at newspapers for both Kingtons, including ones on Ancestry.com and on Genealogybank.  Newspapers in local libraries, digitally at the Library of Congress, and perhaps in state libraries or historical societies should also be referenced.

Time will tell.

Kingston, New York or New Jersey?

This image is 1848 death certificate for George C. Liddell which is contained in the death certificates for the City of Philadelphia from 1803-1915 which appear on FamilySearch.

The obituary for George C. Liddell indicates he died in Kingston, New Jersey. The only differing information between the death certificate and the obituary is the state of death--the obituary indicates New Jersey and the death certificate indicates New York.

Which is it? At this point, I'm not precisely certain. But these records make the important point of transcribing exactly what records say.

The death certificate would contain primary information regarding George's death--hopefully by two individuals who had first hand knowledge of his death. The obituary also contains primary information--it's just that the informant is not known.

An 1848 Obituary for George C. Liddle

It is not often in the course of my own research I encounter an obituary from the early 1840s. But there is one in a Philadelphia newspaper for a George C. Liddle who appears to have been the paternal grandfather of Charles Allen Liddle, who has been mentioned earlier on this blog.

Philadelphia Public Ledger, 25 September 1848, p. 2. Obtained  on Genealogybank

Apparently Capt. George C. Liddle died in Kingston, New Jersey, on 22 September 1848. His residence must have been in Kaighn's Point, New Jersey, right across the river from Philadelphia.

I'll be honest, I was not exactly certain what the location was in New Jersey and a Google search helped me to locate it.

It looks like two of George's children were sent to a school for orphans in Philadelphia. Stay tuned.

Was He Related to the CEO of his Company?

It's been some time since I worked on the Liddle family, so we'll give a short rundown of the reason for the interest.

My children's uncle, Robert Frame, applied for a United States passport in 1921. Included in his passport application is a letter from his boss, Charles A. Liddle, in support of his application. This passport application was obtained on Ancestry.com. It's not unusual for an employer to write a letter of support, but having the vice-president write one is slightly atypical.

There's a minor coincidence with Mr. Liddle that suggests he should be researched further. Normally I don't research the high level executives at companies where relatives worked. However, Robert Frame's maternal grandmother's maiden name was Liddle and while not rare the name is not that common.

I've researched Liddle a little bit before, but didn't make too many inroads and frankly got sidetracked with other things. A recent search for him on Genealogybank located a newspaper clipping from Seattle in 1961 that indicated Liddle died in January of that year.

The 1940 Census for Charles A. Liddle indicates that both he and his father were born in Pennsylvania. The 62 year old is enumerated as a railroad company executive at 235 Linden in New Trier, Illinois (Chicago area), living with his wife Kathryn and two servants.

Charles A. Liddle's own passport application from 1919 (located on Ancestry.com) indicated that his father, William Liddle was born in Pennsylvania.

I'm not certain this means I should drop my search for a connection (Robert Frame's parents were natives of County Cumberland in England and immigrated to the United States in the 1860s). There are two reasons why in this case, the search probably should be continued:

• Robert Frame's family lived in Pennsylvania for a short time after their immigration.
• Robert Frame's mother had relatives of her father--Watsons--living in Pennsylvania when they immigrated. It is possible that more than the Watsons were involved in this chain of migration. 

Note: in my own research, I'm completely citing all the sources used. In blog posts, there's enough detail that those with an interest can obtain the originals. And, as always, sources are always completely cited in Casefile Clues where I usually write these research scenarios up in more complete detail.

Liddle's draft card from World War II is somewhat unusual and I'm working on a blog post on that as well.

Frustrating my search is the fact that there was a Charles Liddle who lived in the Rockford, Illinois, area.

Stay tuned. We'll have an update when more has been located. In the meantime, never ignore the potential possibility that your relative's boss might have somehow had a connection to him besides employment.

A better scan from Haltwhistle marriages 1819

This scan comes from marriages in the Northumberland parish of Haltwhistle in 1819. I must have had the settings better on this one as the image is generally sharper and retains that sharpness when I zoom in.

I scanned the entire page when making the digital image, but the year of the record was only written on the very top of the page and that was cut off when I cropped the image to show the desired entry.

I still think it is really neat that at this point in time the marriage records included the signature of the bride and groom--Robert Liddell and Jane Cowing. Of course, the name was spelled Liddel on the document by the curate, Richard Grainger.

This scan was made on the newer machines in the Family History Libary. And hopefully if time allows, it will be part of an article for my weekly column "Casefile Clues."